Clint Mathis

DadOf8 · 06-21-2005, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RSL_Fan

I agree with everyone about Clint and his struggles. However, I thought he did pretty good last game trying to set people up for goals. Yes, he should've had at least 2 assists last game...but is that necessarily Clint's fault? One ALMOST assist that comes to mind...a delivery to the far post that I believe O'Brien got a head on and ALMOST put it in the goal, but a goalie by the name of Onstadt got his paw on it before it crossed the line. I think Clint will get online and please us all eventually...hopefully sooner than later.

I hope he does get online and post, because he's one BIG reason I go to the games. I'd like to tell him how much I appreciate him playing for RSL.

One thing I've learned from watching the Jazz is that fans in Utah are fickle. You all hated Mark Eaton until he left. You all hated Greg Ostertag until the Jazz went from a 43 win season to a 26 win season.

There's a reason that Elinger wanted Mathis on this team. Mathis is a leader. I like the fact that he's a hot-head because when one of his team mates screws up, he will let them know it. I was reading about practice yesterday and about Clint carpet f-bombing RES because he was upset with one of his team mates. I'm know his team mates respect him, Jaime Watson even said so on his interview on KSL late Sunday night. Clint's a leader, we need him on the team. If he hasn't done anything by the end of the season, then maybe we should consider getting rid of him.

Stucki · 06-21-2005, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DadOf8

I hope he does get online and post, because he's one BIG reason I go to the games. I'd like to tell him how much I appreciate him playing for RSL.

One thing I've learned from watching the Jazz is that fans in Utah are fickle. You all hated Mark Eaton until he left. You all hated Greg Ostertag until the Jazz went from a 43 win season to a 26 win season.

There's a reason that Elinger wanted Mathis on this team. Mathis is a leader. I like the fact that he's a hot-head because when one of his team mates screws up, he will let them know it. I was reading about practice yesterday and about Clint carpet f-bombing RES because he was upset with one of his team mates. I'm know his team mates respect him, Jaime Watson even said so on his interview on KSL late Sunday night. Clint's a leader, we need him on the team. If he hasn't done anything by the end of the season, then maybe we should consider getting rid of him.

Amen on the Jazz fans. Utah fans are known for being bandwagon jumpers, how else would you explain BYU fans and Ron McBride getting fired? 🙄

DadOf8 · 06-21-2005, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrstucki

Amen on the Jazz fans. Utah fans are known for being bandwagon jumpers, how else would you explain BYU fans and Ron McBride getting fired? 🙄

BYU fans were responsible for Ron McBride getting fired?

Old Ska · 06-21-2005, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DadOf8

There's a reason that Elinger wanted Mathis on this team. Mathis is a leader. I like the fact that he's a hot-head because when one of his team mates screws up, he will let them know it. I was reading about practice yesterday and about Clint carpet f-bombing RES because he was upset with one of his team mates. I'm know his team mates respect him, Jaime Watson even said so on his interview on KSL late Sunday night. Clint's a leader, we need him on the team. If he hasn't done anything by the end of the season, then maybe we should consider getting rid of him.

Remember, he is pretty expensive. And his Hannover 96 stint was a fiasco. Did Mathis call Ellinger and beg for a spot, or did Ellinger go after Mathis? I'm not sure we know for certain what happened there. He had big time conflicts with 3 out of 4 previous coaches, and has had conflicts with lots of his team mates in the past (although I will say that none have been made public on RSL yet). He is sort of the Dennis Rodman of MLS, or maybe the Latrell Spreewel. As fas as being a leader..I just wonder how guys like Tiger, Pope and Williams react to Mathis behind closed doors, or behind his back. Of course Watson looks up to him, he has probably been watching him play since he was 8.

But, even though it looks that way, I am not totally down on the guy yet. I say give him at least this season, and probably more unless he really screws up in a big, big way (say, an extremely blatant red card or a truly awful off-pitch incident). He seems to hate being benched or passed over in any way more than anything, I would like to see him channel that into a big-time push for the rest of the season...not just swearing in practice. I could swear in practice. Ellinger might just be the one person who could direct Mathis' personality quirks into something positive, and I think he should get plenty of opportunity to try to do so. I definately would take Mathis over Kreis at this point, and if I were the betting type, I would bet that one of the two is gone after this season.

Stucki · 06-21-2005, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DadOf8

BYU fans were responsible for Ron McBride getting fired?

Yes, they stopped coming to the Utah games because seats at Cougar Stadium became availabe while Crowton was there. :D

Stucki · 06-21-2005, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old Ska

Remember, he is pretty expensive. And his Hannover 96 stint was a fiasco. Did Mathis call Ellinger and beg for a spot, or did Ellinger go after Mathis? I'm not sure we know for certain what happened there. He had big time conflicts with 3 out of 4 previous coaches, and has had conflicts with lots of his team mates in the past (although I will say that none have been made public on RSL yet). He is sort of the Dennis Rodman of MLS, or maybe the Latrell Spreewel. As fas as being a leader..I just wonder how guys like Tiger, Pope and Williams react to Mathis behind closed doors, or behind his back. Of course Watson looks up to him, he has probably been watching him play since he was 8.

But, even though it looks that way, I am not totally down on the guy yet. I say give him at least this season, and probably more unless he really screws up in a big, big way (say, an extremely blatant red card or a truly awful off-pitch incident). He seems to hate being benched or passed over in any way more than anything, I would like to see him channel that into a big-time push for the rest of the season...not just swearing in practice. I could swear in practice. Ellinger might just be the one person who could direct Mathis' personality quirks into something positive, and I think he should get plenty of opportunity to try to do so. I definately would take Mathis over Kreis at this point, and if I were the betting type, I would bet that one of the two is gone after this season.

I'm confused. Did you just say something positive about Coach E? 🙄

DadOf8 · 06-21-2005, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrstucki

Yes, they stopped coming to the Utah games because seats at Cougar Stadium became availabe while Crowton was there. :D

Your logic is impeccable. Are you sure you're not a philosophy teacher?

Stucki · 06-21-2005, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DadOf8

Your logic is impeccable. Are you sure you're not a philosophy teacher?

No thank you, geography is close enough.

utah_heretic · 06-21-2005, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DadOf8

Clint's a leader, we need him on the team. If he hasn't done anything by the end of the season, then maybe we should consider getting rid of him.

I'm a Mathis fan, so I expect to be bashed for it a bit. To get rid of Mathis would be the most foolhardy thing I could possibly imagine. He is without question Real's most talented player.

Let's just step back and take a reality-check for a moment. This team incorporates some dramatically different styles of play. Williams, Kreis, Mathis, Selolwane, Fitzpatrick...none of these guys come from similar football philosophies. They are all good players, but they are all playing roles which they do not ordinarily play.

The biggest hole we have is obviously in central midfield. We drafted for the future in this position with Besagno, and we'll see what difference a couple of years makes. Mathis, while a good posession player, is showcased best making unexpected and creative things happen on the field...he has good vision, and is dangerous enough with the ball to create great opportunities. But he is not a holding midfielder.

I really thought Andy was going to fill that role for us, but we can't seem to fit him to that role because he doesn't play defense well. He can hold in the midfield, but plays a back forward attack style...good if you have good men in the air and good crosses.

Kreis has a great nose for goal...it's virtually his hallmark. He's lost a step over time, and while he's enormously quick, he simply isn't going to outrun defenses. Because we have a hole in the midfield, we've been trying to play an attacking style which presses the attack to a forward and allows our midfield to press forward to receive the ball with better vision. Unfortunately, this means it's difficult for us to attack on a break, and this was compounded by the fact that Kreis would just get hammered as a post man since defenders didn't respect his speed. We brought in Dante to give us some pace, but we haven't learned to use him yet.

Selolwane suffers from the same sorts of problems Kreis does when we put him up front...i.e. he gets man-handled. He is great on the ball, but plays a more askew and subtle attacking style. He tends to slow the pace of the game in favor of creating opportunity through misdirection.

Tiger, whose field presence and dribbling skill I really like, doesn't seem well suited to the wing, as his crosses are suspect, and apparently is used to a more supported attack, as he seems constantly to dribble in a mad fury to some place where it is nearly impossible to support his run...For a while I likened him to Don Quixote, always taking the path of greatest resistance.

What's the solution? Well, we either give Ellinger the time to do his job and fit these pieces together, or we try to find pieces that fit better together. I think it is far more sensible to talk about who we need to support Mathis than to talk of replacing him...ludicrous.

DadOf8 · 06-21-2005, 07:57 PM

Heretic, I hope you didn't misunderstand me. I feel the same way as you, that people are calling for his head too soon. I think at the end of the season Elinger might look at his numbers and make a decision then whether to keep him on the team or cut him. I like the energy that he brings to each game, other players feed off that. Even if he's not scoring goals, he's out there making things happen and I like that about him. I like that he's out there giving the refs a hard time, who ever said their job should be easy? It bothers me when I go to games and I hear fans around me saying things like, "Mathis is a hot head, all he does is argue with the refs." and "Mathis is only good at getting yellow cards." In my opinion, Mathis is our best player, he's just in a slump.